(from TFB, in part)
GLOCK VICE PRESIDENT: “Continue MHS, Don’t Settle for SIG”
– Glock Asks Army to Keep Testing Pistols
Glock isn’t done yet: Despite being passed over by the Army and having their protest of the MHS contract rejected by the GAO, Glock is still hoping for a chance. In a recent interview with Matthew Cox of Military.com, Glock Vice President Josh Dorsey spoke out against the Army’s decision to adopt the SIG Sauer P320 as the new M17 Modular Handgun System. Dorsey’s comments, excerpted below, express dissatisfaction with the Army’s selection process:
“This is not about Glock. This is not about Sig. And it’s not about the U.S. Army,” Dorsey, a retired Marine, told Military.com. “It’s about those that are on the ground, in harm’s way.”
It comes down to “the importance of a pistol, which doesn’t sound like much unless you realize, if you pull a pistol in combat, you are in deep s***.”
“So one of the least important factors as they said in the RFP would be the price; that is what became the most important factor,” Dorsey said.
“So let’s think about that for a minute … you are going to go forward making that decision now without completing the test on the two candidate systems that are in the competitive range? Does that make sense if it’s your son or daughter sitting in that foxhole somewhere?”
I recommend readers click through the link to read the whole thing.
Ultimately, the question of whether SIG Sauer’s P320 handgun will meet Army requirements seems, at the moment, moot. In the face of a 13-year-long procurement process, a suite of already mature competitors, and a $100 million dollar price difference between the bids of the two companies, Glock’s argument for a continuing competition seems thin. There certainly is an argument that Glock’s offering was indeed superior, especially given that Glock was evidently able to satisfy both full-size and compact requirements with a single configuration. However, this must be weighed against the consequence of more time, effort, and money spent to procure a weapon that may not be substantially better than the one already selected. If the Army has made a truly grievous error in procurement, or if there was foul play, then certainly the results of MHS should be re-examined. If, on the other hand, the US Army selected the best deal out of several satisfactory pistol offerings, then re-opening the competition seems unnecessary.
I’ve no dog in this fight. I’ve never been in the military, but I have paid taxes. I’ve owned Glocks; I’ve owned Sigs. I’ve no financial interest in either company.
I like them both, sufficiently.
If it were up to me, we’d still be issuing 1911s…
TFB’s last couple of lines state it best:
If the Army has made a truly grievous error in procurement, or if there was foul play, then certainly the results of MHS should be re-examined. If, on the other hand, the US Army selected the best deal out of several satisfactory pistol offerings, then re-opening the competition seems unnecessary.
(from TFB – James Jarrett)
Released to quite a bit of controversy at the NRA show, the NRA’s Carry Guard program is again the focus of controversy. As listed on the NRA’s Carry Guard website, instructions for prospective students of their “Level 1” program are specifically asked not to bring revolvers or 1911s as “primary firearms” to the classes. This instruction is added as a note to bringing a full-size or compact handgun:
*NOTE: NRA Carry Guard Level One is designed for training with a semi-automatic handgun (Glock 19/17, Sig P226/P228 or equivalent). We will not allow revolvers or 1911s as your primary firearm in this class.
I can understand the reasoning to NOT want revolvers in a semi-auto class, but the decision to specifically bar the 1911 is most peculiar and likely to draw some ire of the NRA membership and potential student base.
I mean, the instruction simply does not add up. The NRA specifically asks for a “semi-automatic handgun” but then disallows America’s favorite semi-auto? I can understand if the program wants a minimum capacity, but even that does not make sense as they mention bringing backup guns, etc which then has the 1911 allowed:
You should bring a secondary firearm that you carry concealed, as well as a holster for such. We will run the course with a primary carry weapon and then run a course of fire with a secondary or back-up gun to evaluate the differences. Please bring at least 40 rounds of ammo appropriate for your carry firearm for this portion of the class. Revolvers, 1911s and/or subcompacts can be used for this portion of the class. (emphasis added)
If anything, the NRA should have set a type of handgun and impartial requirements. Instead, they are managing to shoot themselves in the foot with Carry Guard yet again…
I wonder what compelled the NRA to make such as decision? Many CCW/Constitutional Carry folks with whom I am personally acquainted often carry 1911s.
Could it be this politically correct age is creeping over into firearms choices from politics and ‘popular’ culture?
The NRA did ban ‘other’ CCW schools/insurance from their last convention, undoubtedly to limit competition between them.
I’ll bet is Col. Cooper were still with us (as an NRA Board member) this wouldn’t be a thing.
or even 5.75 mm Velo Dog?
a velo-dog revolver
When I came of (gun) age, the premier cartridge in my circle was .357 Magnum. This was because it was what most law enforcement folks carried – revolvers. (early 1970’s)
Of course, .38 Special was utilized for practice, because it was easier on the gun AND the shooter. And less expensive to shoot.
Semiautomatic pistols were just making their way into law enforcement, with 9 mm Smith & Wesson double actions leading the charge. Single action autos, like the venerable Colt 1911 in .45 ACP, were thought to be at best finicky and unreliable.
Besides, cops carried revolvers and bad guys carried semis. This is what was view as TRUTH.
But with the advancements in metallurgy and polymers, different ammunition and projectors were soon to be seen. Most notably Glock and Beretta, in 9 mm. And after the infamous FBI Miami shootout, the development of the 10 mm, which was later truncated into the .40 S&W.
Carried in DAO and striker-fired weapons, because it was believed genpop recruits (including some small Asians and women) couldn’t safely handle 10 mm or single-action autos!
Even though the military had been teaching single-action autos in .45 ACP for over 70 years!
Recent developments have shown that .45 is not as efficient as once touted. And even federal law enforcement has reverted back to 9 mm over the .40.
And I have it on good authority that even (some) Gunsite instructors decided to shoot 9 mm instead of .45 ACP, and use Isosceles over Weaver stance! Col. Cooper must be spinning in his grave.
Time marches on. As does technology.
Do you carry the ‘latest’ ammo in the ‘most advanced’ machine?
Or are you an old-school guy like me? 🙂
Well, I guess I’ll be moseyin’ down to my buggy, whip and 1911 in hand.
Velo Dog just isn’t big enough for me.
Courtesy of The Firearm Blog…
Closer Than Ever Before To CMP M1911s
The Civilian Marksmanship Program has been providing arms to civilian match shooters and riflemen for over 110 years, but one weapon left off the list of civilian-legal surplus firearms the CMP is allowed to sell to civilian shooters is the venerable 1911 handgun. However, that may soon change. For the past couple of years, variations of the National Defense Authorization Act have been proposed that would change the law establishing the CMP to allow them to sell 1911 handguns to the American public, but so far none of these versions have passed and become law. The most recent version of the NDAA provides for the sale of 1911 handguns (albeit in a different manner than the rifles, i.e. through an FFL) through the organization, and is poised to be signed in the next week. Hognose of WeaponsMan reports:
According to Al Jazeera, which is bent out of shape because the language forbidding the closure of Guantanamo remains, the President will sign the changed National Defense Authorization Act.
The President’s reasons were many and various. The two he most often gave were the use of off-budget “Overseas Contingency Operations” funds to circumvent military spending caps, and the maintenance of spending caps on domestic programs.
The Republican Congressional leadership yielded to the Democrats across the board, discarding the budget sequester principle and going on a spending spree in domestic/welfare spending. Ironically, the OCO money remains, and is increased — but the increase is tapped off for domestic spending also.
The Guantanamo language remains, and more to our point, so does the CMP transfer language. (We discussed it recently, and explained the many gotchas in the text. The law limits CMP sales to a max of 10,000 firearms a year).
The resultant sale of 1911 handguns to the American public, even at a relatively low rate of 10,000 per year, could open the door for historical handgun competitions, perhaps based on a variant of IPSC or USPSA rules, in the same way that National Rifle matches have been cultivated by the CMP. As Hognose writes in his post, the signing of this bill into law does not mean that 1911 handguns will immediately go up for sale on the CMP website immediately; the pistols will have to be transferred from Army inventory to the Program, first, and the new bill requires the CMP to have an FFL to do this, which was previously not necessary for transfers of rifles from the Army to the Program.
– See more at: http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2015/11/15/closer-than-ever-before-to-cmp-m1911s/?utm_source=Newsletter&utm_medium=Email&utm_content=2015-11-17&utm_campaign=Weekly+Newsletter#sthash.xcAEDNZG.dpuf
Wouldn’t THIS be cool?
Of course, I suspect the current administration to put the kibosh on the idea…
(I do remember a previous barber of mine telling me he bought his 1911 from The Pentagon in 1961, for $17.00!? Of course, he may have just taken his when he left…)
Once I became a 1911 junkie, it seemed the search was always on for a lightweight, more-compact, more concealable 1911 pistol.
Why didn’t John Moses Browning (PBUH) develop titanium first? *sigh*
A guy I used to know actually won a Colt Officer’s Model in a competition. An all-steel one. If I remember correctly, it was a Series 80, and constantly had functioning problems.
(I’ve never been a fan of Series 80 lawyer-induced modifications to the genius’s design And this pistol seemed to prove it out.)
However, when you spend free time, hanging out with gunnies, going to gun shows, working part-time in a gun store, shooting guns and reading about guns, sometimes someone offers you a gun.
One of my gunnie friends called me with a LW Officer’s Model, Series 80, he was selling privately. I jumped at it, and dropped her at the smithy to have an ambi safety installed. After a couple days, the smithy called me and advised he couldn’t work on the gun, until the Series 80 mechanism had been replaced (
for safety’s sake, okay, lawyer’s sake). He said he could reinstall new replacement parts and then add the ambidextrous safety (for an additional fee, of course). The previous owner had disabled/removed the lawyer-created parts.
I said yes, and eventually the work was done. I also added some nice rosewood stocks, as well, and tritium night sights as I remember.
A thing of beauty – and I got her for a bargain price, even with the extra work!
She shot okay, better than the stainless Commander, but with the Series 80 works reinstalled. the trigger was lawyeriffic. I pictured tiny guys in grey flannel suits inside keeping the trigger from operating smoothly or lightly. Consequently, I didn’t shoot or carry her much. I don’t even remember if I consulted with the previous owner about re-cannibalizing the safety mechanism, or not.
She became a safe queen.
And, when I carried a 1911, it was the full-sized custom National Match gun that was my first 1911. The one I still own.
And now, the firearms industry seems intent on making Officer’s Model-sized 9mms and .380s.
Why, I’ll never understand.
We all know .45 ACP is God’s Caliber!
One advantage of having friends who work at a local gun store, is they get to know your tastes, wants and desires. About firearms, anyway.
One afternoon, Bob H. (yes, another Bob) calls me from the shop. He said he remembered my proclivities for rusting anything in sight, and a gun just arrived which I might like. A Stainless Lightweight Commander.
I couldn’t make tracks fast enough to get to the store!
She was a beauty. Mat stainless slide, alloy frame, black sights and trigger. Of course, being from Colt, she needed the addition of a proper ambidextrous safety. So, without leaving the store after plunking down my cash, into the smithy she went.
Patience is not one of my virtues, but, I am working on it.
In a few days, I got the call and picked her up.
Because, I can also be a bit compulsive, even though I had perfectly suitable holsters at home I could use, I immediately went next door to The Wilderness. Therein, Ralph Holzhaus custom-fashioned the latest in Kydex finery he had just begun selling for my new baby.
The end result was a brand new stainless carry piece, in a brand new Kydex concealment holster.
I was jazzed.
Off to the indoor shooting-range.
It had been a few weeks since I’d gone shooting. The pistol functioned fine and I knew my skills were adequate.
I couldn’t keep a decent group to save my life! (emphasis obvious)
But, I returned on a regular basis, because, this was to be my new carry gun. I even added flat-finish, smooth, ebony stocks.
I don’t know if it was the trigger, the bushing or what, I just couldn’t get this firearm to perform on command. And, isn’t that what she was for? Wasn’t she a Commander?
So, she became largely a safe queen, until I traded her for another gun. And, one of the GOBs (good-old-boys store regulars, – a fireman) picked her up.
And, he told me she shot ‘okay’. Guess it was me?
And the custom Kydex holster was relegated to the wire milk crate of unused holsters, where it lives, today. I never bought any other Commander-style pistols, so, I’d no more use for it.
Sweet looking piece, though!
|not mine – GunsAmerica
Some years back, I was visiting my favorite gun store, drooling over the usual collection of toys, when I spied some interesting ones in the .45 case.
There were seven (or perhaps eight) Colt 70 Series, of various flavors, all marked as LNIB (like new in box)!
Turns out, some guy had collected them over the years, and kept them in the original boxes, in storage.
The guy had fallen on hard times (needed some serious dental work) and, as many of us have sadly done, sold them to the shop for badly-needed cash.
Bad for him, good for me!
One of the variants in the case which appealed to me was a Colt National Match, Gold Cup, Series 70, Elliason sights, finished in electroless nickel. This was factory finish, and was not even in the Colt Catalog!
Having toxic perspiration issues, this looked like a gun for me. I bought her, and had the ‘smith install an ambidextrous safety.
And, I bought an unfitted, stainless bushing. And a series of fine grit sandpaper and crocus cloth.
I hand-fitted the bushing. No tools. It took about six hours of manual labor…sand…check fitting…more sanding…check fitting. Until the barrel just cleared the bushing. Snug. Sweet.
Added nice, rosewood stocks.
Then came the test firing.
Smooth, tight, accurate. Not as accurate as my main NM carry gun, but, pretty cool. The only mechanical issue remaining was the adjustable trigger.
Whatever cosmolene or preservative they had placed on the internals had glued itself to the trigger adjustment mechanism. Out came the solvent. For a long time.
I don’t think I ever was able to clear all of the preservative from the trigger. She had just been sitting too long.
But, she shot well, and was my ‘backup’, or ‘New York reload’, as necessary. And, I did sometimes carry her, as she was so pretty.
Of course, she was in the safe.
But, I did find the one (pictured above) at GunsAmerica. So, when I’m ready, they ARE out there.
My first 1911 remains my favorite. My friend Bob sold her to me, in a moment of his weakness, in 1983. She is a late 70’s era, custom-built, 5″, with a Vega stainless frame, Colt National Match slide, Bomar sights, Micro bushing, Armand Swenson ambidextrous safety and combat hammer. I almost forgot-diamond Herrett stocks. She was the race gun design of 1977, for IPSC, essentially. I’ve made a couple minor changes. I replaced the mainspring housing making it flat, rather than curved. And, I had Robbie Barkman coat her in all-black Poly-T, due to my personal corrosion ‘issues’. He also coated her internals and controls in NP3.
Someone messed with the trigger, before I acquired her, so it’s lighter than I would like. It’s about 2 1/2 pounds. I’ve grown used to it over the past 28 years. She probably had 15,000 rounds through her, with no mechanical failure or breakage. (I do replace the recoil spring every 3000 rounds, or so.)
I christened her the Bob Hall Signature Model.
I’m a ‘fair’ shot. With the BHSM, I can make them all touch at 15 yards (with a little work). When I first qualified for my Az CCW license (5 shots-5 yards, 5 shots-10 yards, 70% passing-cake!), the instructor jokingly asked if I’d missed the target, as there was one ragged hole.
The BHSM has accompanied me on legal paper service, security guard jobs, surveillance, qualifications, and just regular wear. And, she’s never failed me.
There’s a list of friends who like to remind me, should I pass before they do, they want her. I anticipate a battle I won’t be here to see.
I’m still here, not yet, be patient!
TODAY, is the Anniversary of the adoption of John Moses Browning’s (pbuh) 1911 semi-automatic pistol as the official sidearm of the United States Army!
I own one, do you?
Nothing further needs to be said.
h/t Roberta X